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+---- Thread: *PBE vs ISFL (with help from iamslm22) - part 2 (/showthread.php?tid=32608)
*PBE vs ISFL (with help from iamslm22) - part 2 - JuOSu - 05-28-2021
Media voucher claim for double media!
For those that did not read the first part, Here it is.
The general purpose of this is to compare the PBE and the ISFL, the two main leagues I am in and I do this with the help of slm who is also a big name in both leagues.
In the first version of this the ISFL ended up winning 8 to 7. Let's see how it goes this time around!
Slm once more came up with 15 topics that I will discuss in more detail below.
Here are those new topics:
Better commish – Bex or Hummus
Better Sim Team
Manic’s better player Taylor or Mclish
Juosu’s best GMing
Better GM – CK or CK
Best non-Julian O’Sullivan (player named O'Sullivan)
Better main discord
Better site
Better current banners
Better consistent Media
Best non-Julian O’Sullivan (player from JuOSu)
Better Dynasty to start league VAN or AZ
Better founder – Rindiee or Ballerstorm
Better set of inaugural GMs
Better current set of GMs
Well these will be tough once again but there are some really interesting topics to discuss in here, so we will look at these in more detail.
Better commish – Bex or Hummus
Well this is immediately an impossible one to answer. But I don't like cop-outs so I will still debate this and see where I land in the end. I already want to apologize to whoever I don't pick, because I do truly think that both of you do a fantastic job. Both commishes have taken over a difficult situation and have done a fantastic job in bettering their respective leagues and continuing on the trend of a lot of growth. Bex has faced some difficult moments that she handled well overall. I think overall she is hampered by the fact that she is held back by some other HO members who in my opinion could be doing a better job. There have been questionable decisions such as the debacle of removing the PT head and some questionable punishments, which weren't necessarily handled by her but are still overseen by her. I think overall she has done very well. Hummus on the other side I think has especially handled very difficult situations well when it comes to the interpersonal connections in the league. He also did well on the official OOTP podcast and in general has done well with league broadening too. While the PBE HO also has a few people that I don't necessarily agree with, Hummus does have the benefit of having one of the most active and best HO members of any league in Poe, who takes a lot of the heat off of Hummus. Hummus suffers a bit in comparison to other PBE commishes because overall we have been very lucky with some good commishes before him. Kolbe was obviously laughable but also saved the league for a while. Majesiu is incredible and did a ton for the league. Jonny2x also did an incredible job for the league as well. Meanwhile Bex I think shines more because the comparison to before her doesn't necessarily look as favorable, with Ballerstorm, Dermot and Dwyer not necessarily always having done the best job or been the most popular among people. This is honestly one of the hardest decisions I have had to make in these. I think ultimately I think that Bex is very very slimly ahead of Hummus. No offense to either though, lots of respect for the work both of you do. (1-0 ISFL)
Better Sim Team
Well this comes at an interesting time. Let's talk about the PBE first. PBE sim team overall does a pretty good job I think. There have been the occasional mess ups of lineups and the like, but they are fairly rare because of the system they employ (more on that in a bit). My biggest gripe with the sim team came last season and the season before where we somehow drew the line on long streams right when it mattered most. Somehow not showing the most important games of the season, partially, was just absolutely abhorrent to me. I was genuinely pissed off and I am glad things are now set in place to avoid that from happening again. Streams can at times be long but that's part of the fun I think. Many of the streamers have good commentary and the duo setup works well for interaction. ISFL doesn't provide commentary which I think is one of the biggest mistakes the league is making right now. On top of that, I feel like the ISFL has constant issues with lineups, especially early in the season. It's practically become a seasonal thing at this point and that goes back a long time to the days where I was GM. I don't understand why it is set up the way it is, with the file basically just always containing errors. I am unsure if the preseason file is still as bad as it was when I was GM but it was basically non existent then. No changes input etc and so by the time regular season came around, no one had time to catch any errors because the preseason file was not accurate anyway. It still seems to be an issue today too because clearly there were lots of issues yesterday still as well. I pretty much go into every season here expecting the first week to be littered with sim errors and I don't think that's really acceptable. If the ISFL has to change one big thing, this is one of them. Easy win for the PBE. (1-1 tie)
Manic’s better player Taylor or Mclish
This one is a tough one actually. I am curious what @manicmav36 thinks about this question as well. In theory, both players were fantastic. Both players made the hall of fame. You really can't go wrong here. Shooty McLish was a First Base man in the PBE who still holds the record for career batting average. First basemen don't do well with WAR, but despite that Shooty is still 22nd all time among batters in WAR and I would estimate that among First Basemen he is likely first. In fact he holds most career records for First Basemen as it turns out, batting average, on base percentage, games, runs, hits, singles, walks and WAR. He was also great defensively with the best career ZR among First Basemen as well. McLish won seven Silver Sluggers and three Gold Gloves. He was a ten time all-star and won five championships. He never won MVP but got third place once. Overall a fantastic career. Owen Taylor on the other hand was a fantastic Running Back who ranks 4th in career rushing yards and first in career rushing touchdowns. He added another 3000 yards in receiving, which puts him 5th all time in scrimmage yards. He is 1st in scrimmage touchdowns and all-purpose touchdowns. Despite those accolades he also never won the MVP award either. He won Offensive player of the year twice, running back of the year six times and was a champion once. All that being said, I think his accomplishments and records in the ISFL are more impressive in the end so I think this one is a win for Taylor and the ISFL (2-1 ISFL)
Juosu’s best GMing
I honestly think I could just put PBE here and no one would be shocked but I guess I will go into some detail about both leagues still. In the ISFL, I was the co-GM for OCO for a bit and while we did win some championships then, I don't really think I did very much back then and think I won't count this. I took over as the GM for NOLA in a very surprising and sudden move in the moment where I was drafted with my player. I actually value my work with NOLA very highly. That team was in an absolute shock of a state with barely any actives left. The war room was basically full of inactives and people who were playing on other teams. It was a mess. Building a big team through the next draft especially and managing to get some absolute legends in Tom Hanks, slothfacekilla and hippo was huge. We built from there together and eventually we managed to win a championship with NOLA as well, while I was the GM. I am very proud of this because I really didn't feel like I knew the league very well at the time and it was tough being the GM at times. But I think building rosters is what I am best at and we did a great job of that in NOLA and really changed the culture of the team. In the PBE, I took over as the Sloths GM in S2. After a tumultuous season and an overhaul of the roster, the team started a really great run of many seasons in a row in the playoffs and won a few titles as well, bringing the first Sloths dynasty. After a small rebuild, we returned back to being a playoff team and while we only won one title in this run, we are still a playoff team in every season basically. This season will mark the 20th time in 25 seasons the Sloths will make the playoffs (most in the league). We have the second most championships with 5 and the second best win% in the league. Easily a win for the Sloths and PBE (2-2 tie)
Better GM – CK or CK
Thanks slm, I wonder why you picked this one lol. Let's see. In the PBE ckroyal was the GM for the Outer Banks Aviators. While they have struggled for a lot of their history, they have been a playoff team 8 times, most under ck. They never won a title, though came close a couple times. Overall they currently sport a .440 win percentage, again most of which came under ck. Of the original six teams, their win percentage and playoff participations rank last of the six teams. They are also the only original six team without a title so far. In the ISFL, CK GMed the San Jose SaberCats. It looks like he is the GM with most games ever played. His overall win % is similar in the ISFL with 45%, however he has three championships with the Sabercats and also three GM of the year awards. Clearly he is better in the ISFL. (3-2 ISFL)
Best non-Julian O’Sullivan (player named O'Sullivan)
This phrasing first confused me, especially because I took it to mean the other way, but that question will come back later still. What slm meant here to ask about the best O'Sullivan which isn't me. There are a few interesting options here and I am still not sure how slm means the question but let's go through some options: Steven O'Sullivan in the PBE was a decent CF who had an alright, kinda average career. Kristy O'Sullivan in the PBE was a pitcher who retired far too quickly. I also want to highlight Cillian O'Sullivan, who isn't related to me but has had an average career in the PBE as well and has pitched for a while! In the ISFL, we also have some of the same O'Sullivans from my siblings but none really had a good career. So I think this one goes to the PBE version of Steven O'Sullivan. (3-3 tie)
Better main discord
I honestly have no fucking clue about this one lol. I never spend any time in the main discords. It's far too many people and the discussions are often completely unrelated. I like what the PBE has done though and there does seem to be some decent discussions sometimes. I have certainly spent more time in the PBE one, so I will go with the PBE (4-3 PBE)
Better site
Oh man, this one might be controversial. Obviously the PBE still goes with the old school jcink forum whereas this website is more personal or made by someone. I don't really know how it works. But I am one of the few people who seems to just prefer jcink. Jcink just tends to work much better for me and much easier to use. There is more information. You can search better and easier. You can look at members more easily. The writing never messes up like it does here for me sometimes. I honestly just prefer everything about jcink. I am well aware that most people will disagree here but I think the move from jcink to this page was one of the worst ideas in the ISFL. Can't stand it. (5-3 PBE)
Better current banners
Honestly, I really dig both banners. The ISFL one is simple but I really love the graphic with the names and the design. The Wraiths logo is just cool and allows for some awesome design. Big fan of it. The PBE one is interesting, cause it is more dynamic, as it is a small video. It really shows a bit of history from the NY side and such. In my eyes though it's a bit too long. I don't know if people really sit and ever watch it, except maybe the first time. Wheras the ISFL one just always looks smooth and nice when you look at it. Big fan of the design and I think the simplicity sticks out here. ISFL wins! (5-4 PBE)
Better consistent Media
I will admit that I am around more in the PBE and read basically every media there while here I am a lot more picky. In the PBE, I think there is some really amazing media and analysis done, but it is just a lot more easily read really. I feel like here in the ISFL there is a LOT more media. And from what I can tell, the quality is honestly really good as well. I don't really think I am the best person to judge this one, but my feeling is that media is absolutely awesome in this league and I do really hope that I find myself reading more of it in the future still. I think that I personally also contribute more here now, cause I don't really have the same need in the PBE as I once had. So yeah, while I think both leagues have great media, I think this league just has a ton more of it and also better quality at times. So another one for the ISFL (5-5 tie)
Best non-Julian O’Sullivan (player from JuOSu)
And now we come to the other version of this question, the way I originally thought it was meant by slm. So there are a few different players I had now. The two Julian O'Sullivans obviously made the Hall of Fame in both leagues, as discussed in the first media. On the other hand, I have three more players now in the two leagues. In the ISFL I had Stan Francisco who was a decent, albeit not great quarterback. He was sort of underwhelming to me. And now I am on my third player here, Medicinal Toblerone, who started out really strong and now the new sim has kinda fucked him over a bit. In the PBE I only have one other player since Julian O'Sullivan, which is my current player there, Stan Antonio. Antonio is still in his prime, about to hit regression for the first time, but he has already won an MVP title two seasons ago and is currently on pace to probably win another MVP there. I think given the projection of where his career is heading, we can already call his career more impressive than that of fellow Stan - Francisco, and say that Stan Antonio is my best non Julian O'Sullivan player. I would think that actually Stan Antonio has a chance to be better than ISFL Julian O'Sullivan as well. Really pleased with his career so far. PBE re-takes the lead! (6-5 PBE)
Better Dynasty to start league VAN or AZ
I don't know if I even want to call AZ a dynasty. At the very least it is a dynasty with an asterisk, but more on that in a bit. The Vandals didn't get into the playoffs in S1, but they were already the best team in TPE then. After that, they started a reign of terror, winning five titles in a row, though they were not always the best team in that time. Still, no one can deny the Vandals crushed the league in these early seasons and they were an excellent team, put together with by far the best roster from the S1 and S2 drafts. In the ISFL, Arizona won the first three titles and got into the finals in S4 I believe. They were the best team early on and also dominated. However, how much of it was shaped by one Er. The S2 draft especially was shaped by OL and other players that AZ got due to the Er multi situation. Even without it, AZ could have been great, but with that in mind, I really have to add an asterisk to that dynasty. On top of it, the Vandals managed to win more titles even without cheating. Well, without obvious cheating like this, they did get helped by an HO putting a ridiculous cap to help them out. But yeah, Vandals win this one. (7-5 PBE)
Better founder – Rindiee or Ballerstorm
Lol. Well this is a fascinating one. I must admit, I don't know about too many things that Ballerstorm did after creating the league. I believe he was briefly in HO and then quickly left the league entirely. From what I know about him, he had good intentions and did some decent work at times, but he was just around such a short time that this league is now almost entirely different than what he founded, which is rather fascinating in itself. On the other hand, rindiee created the PBE and then immediately became a GM. He abandoned his team after a season in an absolute abysmal state, with like 2-3 actives left on the team after a season. He also was part of one of the bigger scandals of S1, where he exposed a user and changed their forum name, something he was only able to do since he founded the league. Perhaps having admin rights is something a GM shouldn't have, though I guess him and Kolbe disagreed. Well, rindiee returned a few times since, mostly creating players that never really amounted to anything. While Ballerstorm basically did not amount to anything, I believe that being a net zero is honestly enough to get the win here, since I believe that rindiee has hurt the PBE more than he has helped it. (7-6 PBE)
Better set of inaugural GMs
Well this was an interesting research project. I must admit, a lot of these names no longer really ring a bell in some cases. There was a LOT of early turnover in GM roles in both leagues and frankly, neither list blew me away. Let's look at it in more detail. PBE had ckroyal, Bayley, iamslm22, Dwyer, cosbornballboy, tubzaphobia, rindiee, waters, tlk742, 4d chess, shadowz and yurt. Of those, ck, Bayley, slm, tlk, shadowz and yurt are really the only ones of note that have achieved anything or stayed around a while successfully. Dwyer was around but never did much, cosborn and tubza were gone quickly just like rindiee and waters. 4d Chess was also quiet most of the time. Ckroyal, slm, shadowz and tlk are probably the best names on the list who actually were successful long term GMs. In the ISFL we had Dwyer, Adam2552, Broken, everyday, incitehysteria, noble, graphed, jbearly, ckroyal, percales, Nuck and RFFO. Of those, only ckroyal and Dwyer were GMs by season 3. Insane turnover once again here. There are certainly names I recognize on the list, like Adam and incite and noble and Nuck who were known and successful in some ways with players or at least known for the wrong reasons like noble. But really due to longevity, really only ckroyal and Dwyer seem like successful inaugural GMs. I think in this way it's very easy to say that the PBE just wins this one. (8-6 PBE)
Better current set of GMs
This is going to be a longer list to go through. In the PBE we have Symmetrik, Netlandic, ppaul317, BigUnitBabs, Rayzor_7, AW13, soryantyler, Leafer, PetraLikesBaseball, CMac8, drenandtarb, dieselj123, JuOSu, bjbren17, Sam, AJay887, supertardis101, JKortesi81, MisObvious, JoshTheJew, zakkyjohns, TayJay, RedArrow12c, Tigerfan895, jsteele14, Bauer, Frick_Nasty, PersonMann, Eldorian, Philliesphan96, CDoesIT and Brane_Chyld. I am not going to discuss these in detail because I am obviously pretty close with some of these. But I think it's fair to say that some of these names are better GMs than others. A lot are very new as well, due to a lot of turnover in this current season. Some are long term GMs that I think have done a great job, like PersonMann and Babs. Some are newer but are doing good work, like MisObvious. Some I obviously just don't think should be GM. In the ISFL we have - well first off, let me say if the better site hadn't already been decided, it would win even more now since apparently the ISFL website doesn't even fucking show who the current GMs of teams are like jcink does in PBE. Blew my mind that this is not a thing here. So in the ISFL we have Hallmonitor_20, Frick_Nasty, Sylphreni, SchwarzNarr, Punter715, ShnarlyDude, flyeaglesfly29, PMoney, Z-Whiz, Crunk, ddrector, mithrandir, Blasoon, Memento Mori, ckroyal92, Matty7478, Amidships, Kyle, Bayley, TheCC, Attopax, siddhus, Frostbite, sacrosanct, Highhaschdi, Dewalt27, zaynzk and TheRocheLimit. Honestly, for as active as I am in this league it is embarrassing how many names I genuinely don't recognize. That being said, there are some really great GMs on this list too, including my own GMs obviously. But also some other big names here! Shoutout to Frick for being the only current GM who is a GM in both leagues, though obviously others have done it before, including ckroyal, Bayley and myself. Honestly, with lack of evidence, I am just leaning towards giving this point to the PBE since I know the GMs better and I think overall the quality is pretty high currently. Obviously the recent turnover has made things harder but all in all I am very happy with the quality of GMs there right now. So yeah, PBE wins this one. (9-6 PBE).
So there you have it. After the first article where the ISFL triumphantly won in the end, this time the PBE takes the win. I guess this means I will have to do one more of these eventually to decide an ultimate winner since now it is 1-1 after two articles haha.
Thank you for reading and let me know if you have any suggestions for the next article or if you disagree with me on any of the points. Other opinions would be great to see!
RE: PBE vs ISFL (with help from iamslm22) - part 2 - zaynzk - 05-28-2021
Wait Dermot was Commish 0:
RE: PBE vs ISFL (with help from iamslm22) - part 2 - .simo - 05-28-2021
I like my commishes to not champion dumb ideas like promotion and relegation. Bex for me.
RE: PBE vs ISFL (with help from iamslm22) - part 2 - DarknessRising - 05-28-2021
I ask how PBE displays there GM's. Scrolling to each team and checking there is probably annoying to do, but the GM's are all on the employee list so i think they are easy to find in the ISFL. Not in pbe so just curious how they have it
RE: *PBE vs ISFL (with help from iamslm22) - part 2 - Mooty99 - 05-29-2021
PBE website is jinck which just sucks so so hard, both ISFL and SHL have moved away from that terrible monster so no way PBEs is better
RE: *PBE vs ISFL (with help from iamslm22) - part 2 - Raven - 05-29-2021
Jcink supremacy
RE: *PBE vs ISFL (with help from iamslm22) - part 2 - White Cornerback - 05-29-2021
(05-28-2021, 06:09 PM)JuOSu Wrote: Well this is immediately an impossible one to answer. But I don't like cop-outs so I will still debate this and see where I land in the end. I already want to apologize to whoever I don't pick, because I do truly think that both of you do a fantastic job. Both commishes have taken over a difficult situation and have done a fantastic job in bettering their respective leagues and continuing on the trend of a lot of growth. Bex has faced some difficult moments that she handled well overall. I think overall she is hampered by the fact that she is held back by some other HO members who in my opinion could be doing a better job. There have been questionable decisions such as the debacle of removing the PT head and some questionable punishments, which weren't necessarily handled by her but are still overseen by her. I think overall she has done very well. Hummus on the other side I think has especially handled very difficult situations well when it comes to the interpersonal connections in the league. He also did well on the official OOTP podcast and in general has done well with league broadening too. While the PBE HO also has a few people that I don't necessarily agree with, Hummus does have the benefit of having one of the most active and best HO members of any league in Poe, who takes a lot of the heat off of Hummus. Hummus suffers a bit in comparison to other PBE commishes because overall we have been very lucky with some good commishes before him. Kolbe was obviously laughable but also saved the league for a while. Majesiu is incredible and did a ton for the league. Jonny2x also did an incredible job for the league as well. Meanwhile Bex I think shines more because the comparison to before her doesn't necessarily look as favorable, with Ballerstorm, Dermot and Dwyer not necessarily always having done the best job or been the most popular among people. This is honestly one of the hardest decisions I have had to make in these. I think ultimately I think that Bex is very very slimly ahead of Hummus. No offense to either though, lots of respect for the work both of you do. (1-0 ISFL)hello yes its me
Meanwhile Bex I think shines more because the comparison to before her doesn't necessarily look as favorable, with Ballerstorm, Dermot and Dwyer not necessarily always having done the best job or been the most popular among people.
With all due respect (very little to none), I wanna touch on this. I'm not here to go shit on Bex but it will happen by proxy for sure. I don't have any issues with Bex as a person, even to this day I don't have any issues with her at all since I left the league, nor did I really have any with her when I was in the league (bar certain 5head single digit low brain frequency decisions). I get your gripes with me and Dwyer because for as far as I've been aware of you, you've been happy to say shit behind closed doors because you can't say anything with your chest. You even did this in this same article where you mentioned certain HO members hampering Bex but didn't even name drop them, but you were okay to call it out, not take any responsibility for the blowback of it.
In terms of Baller, I don't even know if you were around when he started the league, or if you were on one of your alternate accounts that falls off the face of the earth after they hit the draft stage. Baller created and ran the league til about July/August 2017 when by that point he got burned out, much if not all of the very structures that exist in the league today are down to his original concepts and early groundwork. But again if you weren't around the league then, then I get that. It's tough to do research, especially in a league with as many people who are still around from S1 are still here today.
I think it's an important distinction to seperate this by saying that being commish is the worst job in sim league sports history other than one named simmer. You deal with a community with the average IQ of a juicer xqcL but the age is in the ranges of 20-30. Now whatever about Dwyer on a personal level, I shit on his decisions (as a HO Board) as did most of the community until he eventually retired and left the league and hopefully hes in a happier stage of his life now. Now I liked the insinuation that both me and Dwyer in our respective stints didn't do the "best" but I don't remember me or Dwyer when we were commissioners having self sabotaged ourselfs. I don't remember running and signing off on a Dermott's Bachelor event, being OK with the announcement, seeing blowback and then immediately throwing one of my closest friends on the site under the bus to save my own skin, because let's not beat around the bush, this happened.
I also don't remember at any point of his time as commish, Dwyer being exposed for running a private discord server in which he would consistently rag and say overall absolutely awful things about the people he's leading in the league. Especially not stuff like saying you'd like to organise somebody to meet up with another user in the league and murder them. Because again this happened, just it wasn't during Dwyer, Baller or even my own stints as commish.
I dont remember Baller having a hand in firing one of the most efficient and well liked PT leaders in our time because of a slight level of leniency regarding timelines and then for the next couple of weeks going completely ghost out there regarding any communication on the decision, again all this stuff happened, just not during Dwyer, Baller or my time as commish.
I don't remember any of the Big 3, being involved in an investigation regarding a discord server and then in a last second gasp of desperation, we deleted the very messages that would incriminate ourselves and then try to play it off like we didn't literally tamper with evidence and damn ourselves in the eyes of the public and private. But this did happen, it just didn't happen to any of the 3.
It's important to say that, I'm not saying we didn't all have our issues or there werent numerous scandals during every single commish's run in the NSFL/ISFL because there absolutely was. The difference between the Big 3 (what I'm calling the 3 Commissioners before Bex) and Bex is that for the largest part, any scandal or issues the Big 3 dealt with were not caused by themselves. I've never seen a commissioner not named Kolbe self sabotage as much as I've seen Bex do in her time as commissioner. Literally the three biggest things/issues during her time as Commish were all directly caused by her own doing.
Again I've got nothing against Bex, and she's probably of the sort to recognise that that entire Bex Bachelor event and the discord server stuff, and the deleting of the discord server messages during an investiagtion was absolutely braindead stuff. FWIW DylanDeluxe can go yeet himself off a cliff for exposing the whole thing and how maliciously he went about it.
To close, I find the most popular among people comment to be pretty spot on, I'm aware of my standing and reputation, I didn't take the role of commish to be liked, I just wanted things to work, and they did. Dwyer wanted things to work, and they did. Baller wanted things to work, and they did. Bex wanted things to work, but first she got caught in a game of chinese whispers and game of thrones but eventually they did begin to work.
RE: PBE vs ISFL (with help from iamslm22) - part 2 - JuOSu - 05-29-2021
(05-28-2021, 09:22 PM)DarknessRising Wrote: I ask how PBE displays there GM's. Scrolling to each team and checking there is probably annoying to do, but the GM's are all on the employee list so i think they are easy to find in the ISFL. Not in pbe so just curious how they have it
We also have a job listings page but mostly people just look like this, so you can see by who leads the forum who the GMs are in one view for all of them:
![[Image: Bildschirmfoto_2021-05-29_um_13.50.18.png]](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/485215905173995534/848166415781462036/Bildschirmfoto_2021-05-29_um_13.50.18.png)
RE: *PBE vs ISFL (with help from iamslm22) - part 2 - JuOSu - 05-29-2021
(05-29-2021, 06:16 AM)White Cornerback Wrote:(05-28-2021, 06:09 PM)JuOSu Wrote: Well this is immediately an impossible one to answer. But I don't like cop-outs so I will still debate this and see where I land in the end. I already want to apologize to whoever I don't pick, because I do truly think that both of you do a fantastic job. Both commishes have taken over a difficult situation and have done a fantastic job in bettering their respective leagues and continuing on the trend of a lot of growth. Bex has faced some difficult moments that she handled well overall. I think overall she is hampered by the fact that she is held back by some other HO members who in my opinion could be doing a better job. There have been questionable decisions such as the debacle of removing the PT head and some questionable punishments, which weren't necessarily handled by her but are still overseen by her. I think overall she has done very well. Hummus on the other side I think has especially handled very difficult situations well when it comes to the interpersonal connections in the league. He also did well on the official OOTP podcast and in general has done well with league broadening too. While the PBE HO also has a few people that I don't necessarily agree with, Hummus does have the benefit of having one of the most active and best HO members of any league in Poe, who takes a lot of the heat off of Hummus. Hummus suffers a bit in comparison to other PBE commishes because overall we have been very lucky with some good commishes before him. Kolbe was obviously laughable but also saved the league for a while. Majesiu is incredible and did a ton for the league. Jonny2x also did an incredible job for the league as well. Meanwhile Bex I think shines more because the comparison to before her doesn't necessarily look as favorable, with Ballerstorm, Dermot and Dwyer not necessarily always having done the best job or been the most popular among people. This is honestly one of the hardest decisions I have had to make in these. I think ultimately I think that Bex is very very slimly ahead of Hummus. No offense to either though, lots of respect for the work both of you do. (1-0 ISFL)hello yes its me
Meanwhile Bex I think shines more because the comparison to before her doesn't necessarily look as favorable, with Ballerstorm, Dermot and Dwyer not necessarily always having done the best job or been the most popular among people.
With all due respect (very little to none), I wanna touch on this. I'm not here to go shit on Bex but it will happen by proxy for sure. I don't have any issues with Bex as a person, even to this day I don't have any issues with her at all since I left the league, nor did I really have any with her when I was in the league (bar certain 5head single digit low brain frequency decisions). I get your gripes with me and Dwyer because for as far as I've been aware of you, you've been happy to say shit behind closed doors because you can't say anything with your chest. You even did this in this same article where you mentioned certain HO members hampering Bex but didn't even name drop them, but you were okay to call it out, not take any responsibility for the blowback of it.
In terms of Baller, I don't even know if you were around when he started the league, or if you were on one of your alternate accounts that falls off the face of the earth after they hit the draft stage. Baller created and ran the league til about July/August 2017 when by that point he got burned out, much if not all of the very structures that exist in the league today are down to his original concepts and early groundwork. But again if you weren't around the league then, then I get that. It's tough to do research, especially in a league with as many people who are still around from S1 are still here today.
I think it's an important distinction to seperate this by saying that being commish is the worst job in sim league sports history other than one named simmer. You deal with a community with the average IQ of a juicer xqcL but the age is in the ranges of 20-30. Now whatever about Dwyer on a personal level, I shit on his decisions (as a HO Board) as did most of the community until he eventually retired and left the league and hopefully hes in a happier stage of his life now. Now I liked the insinuation that both me and Dwyer in our respective stints didn't do the "best" but I don't remember me or Dwyer when we were commissioners having self sabotaged ourselfs. I don't remember running and signing off on a Dermott's Bachelor event, being OK with the announcement, seeing blowback and then immediately throwing one of my closest friends on the site under the bus to save my own skin, because let's not beat around the bush, this happened.
I also don't remember at any point of his time as commish, Dwyer being exposed for running a private discord server in which he would consistently rag and say overall absolutely awful things about the people he's leading in the league. Especially not stuff like saying you'd like to organise somebody to meet up with another user in the league and murder them. Because again this happened, just it wasn't during Dwyer, Baller or even my own stints as commish.
I dont remember Baller having a hand in firing one of the most efficient and well liked PT leaders in our time because of a slight level of leniency regarding timelines and then for the next couple of weeks going completely ghost out there regarding any communication on the decision, again all this stuff happened, just not during Dwyer, Baller or my time as commish.
I don't remember any of the Big 3, being involved in an investigation regarding a discord server and then in a last second gasp of desperation, we deleted the very messages that would incriminate ourselves and then try to play it off like we didn't literally tamper with evidence and damn ourselves in the eyes of the public and private. But this did happen, it just didn't happen to any of the 3.
It's important to say that, I'm not saying we didn't all have our issues or there werent numerous scandals during every single commish's run in the NSFL/ISFL because there absolutely was. The difference between the Big 3 (what I'm calling the 3 Commissioners before Bex) and Bex is that for the largest part, any scandal or issues the Big 3 dealt with were not caused by themselves. I've never seen a commissioner not named Kolbe self sabotage as much as I've seen Bex do in her time as commissioner. Literally the three biggest things/issues during her time as Commish were all directly caused by her own doing.
Again I've got nothing against Bex, and she's probably of the sort to recognise that that entire Bex Bachelor event and the discord server stuff, and the deleting of the discord server messages during an investiagtion was absolutely braindead stuff. FWIW DylanDeluxe can go yeet himself off a cliff for exposing the whole thing and how maliciously he went about it.
To close, I find the most popular among people comment to be pretty spot on, I'm aware of my standing and reputation, I didn't take the role of commish to be liked, I just wanted things to work, and they did. Dwyer wanted things to work, and they did. Baller wanted things to work, and they did. Bex wanted things to work, but first she got caught in a game of chinese whispers and game of thrones but eventually they did begin to work.
Yeah, while I think some of the points you raise are a little silly, overall I tend to agree with most of what you said. As you may have noticed, I did point out that that opinion partially comes from how other people look back on your time and frankly, it isn't favorable. Meanwhile, I pointed out that I think Hummus looks worse in comparison because people look back fondly on maj and Jonny. Both of them have plenty of issues still. Both have made bad decisions.
Also no offense, but I am also happy to say shit not behind closed doors, I am sure many people will vouch for that. But hey, if you felt the need to come back after a month of not posting just to give your comments, I welcome that. Welcome back to the league and stuff. Hope you enjoy it here.
RE: *PBE vs ISFL (with help from iamslm22) - part 2 - White Cornerback - 05-29-2021
(05-29-2021, 06:58 AM)JuOSu Wrote:(05-29-2021, 06:16 AM)White Cornerback Wrote:(05-28-2021, 06:09 PM)JuOSu Wrote: Well this is immediately an impossible one to answer. But I don't like cop-outs so I will still debate this and see where I land in the end. I already want to apologize to whoever I don't pick, because I do truly think that both of you do a fantastic job. Both commishes have taken over a difficult situation and have done a fantastic job in bettering their respective leagues and continuing on the trend of a lot of growth. Bex has faced some difficult moments that she handled well overall. I think overall she is hampered by the fact that she is held back by some other HO members who in my opinion could be doing a better job. There have been questionable decisions such as the debacle of removing the PT head and some questionable punishments, which weren't necessarily handled by her but are still overseen by her. I think overall she has done very well. Hummus on the other side I think has especially handled very difficult situations well when it comes to the interpersonal connections in the league. He also did well on the official OOTP podcast and in general has done well with league broadening too. While the PBE HO also has a few people that I don't necessarily agree with, Hummus does have the benefit of having one of the most active and best HO members of any league in Poe, who takes a lot of the heat off of Hummus. Hummus suffers a bit in comparison to other PBE commishes because overall we have been very lucky with some good commishes before him. Kolbe was obviously laughable but also saved the league for a while. Majesiu is incredible and did a ton for the league. Jonny2x also did an incredible job for the league as well. Meanwhile Bex I think shines more because the comparison to before her doesn't necessarily look as favorable, with Ballerstorm, Dermot and Dwyer not necessarily always having done the best job or been the most popular among people. This is honestly one of the hardest decisions I have had to make in these. I think ultimately I think that Bex is very very slimly ahead of Hummus. No offense to either though, lots of respect for the work both of you do. (1-0 ISFL)hello yes its me
Meanwhile Bex I think shines more because the comparison to before her doesn't necessarily look as favorable, with Ballerstorm, Dermot and Dwyer not necessarily always having done the best job or been the most popular among people.
With all due respect (very little to none), I wanna touch on this. I'm not here to go shit on Bex but it will happen by proxy for sure. I don't have any issues with Bex as a person, even to this day I don't have any issues with her at all since I left the league, nor did I really have any with her when I was in the league (bar certain 5head single digit low brain frequency decisions). I get your gripes with me and Dwyer because for as far as I've been aware of you, you've been happy to say shit behind closed doors because you can't say anything with your chest. You even did this in this same article where you mentioned certain HO members hampering Bex but didn't even name drop them, but you were okay to call it out, not take any responsibility for the blowback of it.
In terms of Baller, I don't even know if you were around when he started the league, or if you were on one of your alternate accounts that falls off the face of the earth after they hit the draft stage. Baller created and ran the league til about July/August 2017 when by that point he got burned out, much if not all of the very structures that exist in the league today are down to his original concepts and early groundwork. But again if you weren't around the league then, then I get that. It's tough to do research, especially in a league with as many people who are still around from S1 are still here today.
I think it's an important distinction to seperate this by saying that being commish is the worst job in sim league sports history other than one named simmer. You deal with a community with the average IQ of a juicer xqcL but the age is in the ranges of 20-30. Now whatever about Dwyer on a personal level, I shit on his decisions (as a HO Board) as did most of the community until he eventually retired and left the league and hopefully hes in a happier stage of his life now. Now I liked the insinuation that both me and Dwyer in our respective stints didn't do the "best" but I don't remember me or Dwyer when we were commissioners having self sabotaged ourselfs. I don't remember running and signing off on a Dermott's Bachelor event, being OK with the announcement, seeing blowback and then immediately throwing one of my closest friends on the site under the bus to save my own skin, because let's not beat around the bush, this happened.
I also don't remember at any point of his time as commish, Dwyer being exposed for running a private discord server in which he would consistently rag and say overall absolutely awful things about the people he's leading in the league. Especially not stuff like saying you'd like to organise somebody to meet up with another user in the league and murder them. Because again this happened, just it wasn't during Dwyer, Baller or even my own stints as commish.
I dont remember Baller having a hand in firing one of the most efficient and well liked PT leaders in our time because of a slight level of leniency regarding timelines and then for the next couple of weeks going completely ghost out there regarding any communication on the decision, again all this stuff happened, just not during Dwyer, Baller or my time as commish.
I don't remember any of the Big 3, being involved in an investigation regarding a discord server and then in a last second gasp of desperation, we deleted the very messages that would incriminate ourselves and then try to play it off like we didn't literally tamper with evidence and damn ourselves in the eyes of the public and private. But this did happen, it just didn't happen to any of the 3.
It's important to say that, I'm not saying we didn't all have our issues or there werent numerous scandals during every single commish's run in the NSFL/ISFL because there absolutely was. The difference between the Big 3 (what I'm calling the 3 Commissioners before Bex) and Bex is that for the largest part, any scandal or issues the Big 3 dealt with were not caused by themselves. I've never seen a commissioner not named Kolbe self sabotage as much as I've seen Bex do in her time as commissioner. Literally the three biggest things/issues during her time as Commish were all directly caused by her own doing.
Again I've got nothing against Bex, and she's probably of the sort to recognise that that entire Bex Bachelor event and the discord server stuff, and the deleting of the discord server messages during an investiagtion was absolutely braindead stuff. FWIW DylanDeluxe can go yeet himself off a cliff for exposing the whole thing and how maliciously he went about it.
To close, I find the most popular among people comment to be pretty spot on, I'm aware of my standing and reputation, I didn't take the role of commish to be liked, I just wanted things to work, and they did. Dwyer wanted things to work, and they did. Baller wanted things to work, and they did. Bex wanted things to work, but first she got caught in a game of chinese whispers and game of thrones but eventually they did begin to work.
Yeah, while I think some of the points you raise are a little silly, overall I tend to agree with most of what you said. As you may have noticed, I did point out that that opinion partially comes from how other people look back on your time and frankly, it isn't favorable. Meanwhile, I pointed out that I think Hummus looks worse in comparison because people look back fondly on maj and Jonny. Both of them have plenty of issues still. Both have made bad decisions.
Also no offense, but I am also happy to say shit not behind closed doors, I am sure many people will vouch for that.
Yeah, while I think some of the points you raise are a little silly, overall I tend to agree with most of what you said.
aight
As you may have noticed, I did point out that that opinion partially comes from how other people look back on your time and frankly, it isn't favorable.
If you could find even 5 people who had issues with how I ran the league for a year I'd be shocked. It's an important disctinction that I ran the league for exactly 1 of the 4 years I was on site. I never had any issues with the vast majority of the site for a year, the one that I ran it for. The issues really cropped up the most in the latter 2 (Jrs career) because I demanded to get what I want, and did and people didnt like that, yourself included. Along with that I don't have any qualms about saying what I feel, on here or outside of my doorstep in any regard of my life. If you have an issue you can raise it, most people don't because they are bog. It's fine people having an opinion on my time, that's cool, I got what I wanted from the site and moved on after I retired til I got re-directed to this thread.
Meanwhile, I pointed out that I think Hummus looks worse in comparison because people look back fondly on maj and Jonny. Both of them have plenty of issues still. Both have made bad decisions.
I don't know much about hummus or have interacted with him much so I can't comment. FWIW Maj was the PBE commish around my stint and honestly I never had any issues with him and I think the same vice versa but if that's not the case it's news to me. He was the one who we worked with to get a NSFL/PBE partnership going that's been fruitful for both leagues. Jonny I haven't interacted with too much so same as Hummus, I don't know too much. I think Jonny was the one that dealt with the Gurii guy calling me a racist because of my username (5head take) and then banning me as soon as I joined the PBE discord to press him, again no ill will with that guy, he apologised for it anyway.
Also no offense, but I am also happy to say shit not behind closed doors, I am sure many people will vouch for that.
Line them up.
But hey, if you felt the need to come back after a month of not posting just to give your comments, I welcome that. Welcome back to the league and stuff. Hope you enjoy it here.
I don't know if you realised but I retired and left the site, I didn't feel the need to write a heart felt message thanking everybody during my time here. I think the, "you replied here" so you must be back shtick is pretty weak and overused and it's a half decent attempt at deflecting actual criticism. I have a decent amount of people I stay in relative touch with on the site who by occasion turn me into dumb shit, like this. By leaving the site , it doesn't mean I lose the ability to access it, you know that right. The domain doesn't get closed off from me, you can derive the difference between leaving a league and being banned from the league, I'm not actually dead. Logging in for the first time in months ≠ rejoining a league and its community.